blakpower
November 4th, 2005, 02:35 PM
WHEN and HOW to take your supplements
Ok, in this thread, we are going to be discussing how to take the basic supplements. The wheres, the whens, and they whys. Hopefully this will curb down the many simple questions that some newbs have and therefore make this board a bit more productive by keeping to more in depth topics. Not that there's anything wrong with newbs asking questions, but its always better to answer all in one fell soop.
We're going to be discussing this in simple terms. No essays, no studies, no nothing except the most common and result proven methods of taking supplements. We're not going to be splitting hairs by talking about the fine details either. This post is going to be long enough as it is.
NOTE: Please, please PLEASE dont anyone ruin this thread with "I disagree with XYZ because I took it this way and that way and I got results". Cool. Ok. Great for you. We cannot possibly hope to cover every possible scenario, thats why Im sticking only to the most common ones. If you got results another way, great for you. There's always an exception to everything. I mean..... murderers are supposed to go to jail, right? But we all know OJ's walking around free. Always an exception.
Now the first question is "V, how are YOU qualified to talk to US about supplements and how to take them?" Simple: Ive taken them and Ive researched the living hell out of them. Thats how I was able to go from 147 to 174 in 11 months in 2004 while keeping bodyfat in check. Ive also got many, many years experience being a supplement whore back in the day when I believed that I had to take them to see good gains. And guess what? When I was no longer able to afford them, I really didnt see any difference in the gains I was making. It wasnt until february of 2004 that I came here and met a member called musclesntx who taught me about proper dieting and eating for a goal. Once I saw what PROPER nutrition could do, my supplement intake dropped and what supplements I DID take had even better effect. Thats the honest to gods truth.
Not only that, but in doing my research, I saw person after person take everything under the sun, without a proper nutrition program supporting those supps, and have little to no results to show for it in the end. You know the people Im talking about....the loudmouths who constantly correct everyone and talk about all they take, yet dont post pictures because they cant back their talk up. So in a nutshell, you could say Im an average person who has just happened to be lucky enough to see the truth about supplements first hand. Thats all.
Before we go further, let me state for the record, that if supplements really did what the magazine ads lead one to believe, and really, really worked to make us look like those muscled up models, the pros would not need steroids. That is ....that is as simple as I can possibly make that. If you cannot or will not accept that simple first grader logic, then please do us all a favor and stop coming here. Plain and simple. You will only be wasting your time looking for a wonder pill or magic powder and your incesant questions will get old. Period.
On that note, let me tell you what supplements are. You know how a good spotter helps you get out those last two or three reps? Thats what supplements are. That is the perfect analogy for a supplement. We all know that in order to have those last two or three forced reps do us any good, the muscle needs to be driven to a certain point or those forced reps are not going to do much. In other words, you have to have the correct base established first before those last reps can truly be effective. And in this case, the muscle needs to be driven to a certain point where they will be effective.
So imagine going to the gym and only doing two reps with a weight that you can easily do 8-10 reps with. Its not going to work, is it? But those two or three reps will do us plenty good OVER A CERTAIN PERIOD OF TIME if the muscle has been thuroughly worked and the proper base for those last reps has been established first. And thats what supplements do: they work over a certain period of time ONLY IF THE PROPER AND CORRECT BASE HAS BEEN ESTABLISHED FIRST. And that base is a solid, goal oriented nutrition program.
"Eating clean" is not enough. Ive said it before and I will continue to say it; in order for any supplement to be as effective as it can possible be, it needs to have the right nutrition program supporting it. You have to eat for whatever goal you want or those supplements arent going to be as effective as they can possibly be. Why? because all supplements do is SUPPLEMENT! HELLOOO! Supplements by themselves dont do anything. Just like those two or three reps dont do anything unless the muscle has first been driven to a certain point where they will be effective.
Ok, now that that is out of the way, we will be dicussing each supplement in a "what it is", "what it does", and "what it does not do" format. Then and only then will we talk about how to take it because then it will make more sense and you can possibly see why your best friend's brother's sister takes her supplements by snorting them like coke instead of drinking them in a shake.
The supplements we will talk about are 1) protein 2) creatine 3) fat burners. And to a small degree, steroids. Those seem to be the staples of the supplement industry and most other supplements simply are a variation thereof.
PROTEIN POWDERS: Probably the most asked about supplement.
What it is:
Protein powder is basicaly calories from protein in a very condensed form. Nothing more, nothing less.
What it does:
It helps the body build muscle by helping us take in more calories from protein and aiding in recovery. Plain and simple.
What it does not do:
It does not "build" muscle. No protein powder out there will ever "build muscle" by itself. Protein powders can only supplement whatever nutrition program you have by adding more calories from protein. Plain and simple.
Redundant, you say? Sure. But trust me, we cant seem to hammer that point enough for some reason. Consuming protein shakes is not going to do you much good if your body is not already recieving proper nutrition from natural foods. The protein powder has nothing to build on, you see. Protein powder is NOT a natural food and should not replace real food any more than absolutely neccessary. Say for instance you require 200grams of protein a day. Your daily diet, however, only gives you 175 grams of protein. Then you simply use the powder to add the extra 25 grams. Simple.
You do NOT just take protein to be taking it. Its just calories in that sense. In spanish we have a saying that goes "a lo pendejo". Pendejo is basicaly "dumbass". So that spanish saying could easily be "ala dumbass", or without any thought. Taking protein without any regard to a solid, goal oriented diet is , well.....you get the picture.
There are basicaly two kinds of protein: 100% whey, and not 100% whey, often reffered to as "blends". Those blends could be eggwhite protein, casein, micellar, or milk isolate. Whats the difference? Well 100% whey is the quickest burning protein. Thats it. It is because of that that 100% whey is optimal for after workout when the body is craving sustenance to begin the recovery period. It makes little sense to take a slow burning protein at that point in time. I didnt say you COULDNT, just said it doesnt make much sense.
The other proteinss are slow burning, some more than others. The slower the protein, the better it is suited for non workout use because the body will absorb it slower and have a steady source of nutrient throughout the day. Not like the "quick hit" of 100% whey. During the day we dont need a quick hit, we need constant nutrient, and blends provide that.
They are also optimal for that much beloved night time shake. Your body is basicaly fasting during those 8 hours of sleep, so having a slow burning protein in your system helps keep catabolism in check and prevents you from having to take a whey shake in the morning to counter it. Im sorry, but using whey in the morning like that is really not very smart. Oh, you can definately do that if you want, but its the same as changing the radiator fluid in your car AFTER it has frozen. Better to change it beforehand than to try and repair the damage afterwards. Thats also basic first grader logic.
"Hey V, which is the slowest burning protein??"
Sorry, bros. Im not touching that one. At our levels, we are not going to notice the difference between one protein that aborbs in 8 hours vs. one that absorbs in 6. Unless you are cut and ripped like a pro bodybuilder, where you can see the fine details and the littlest things can make a major difference, you're not going to notice anything drastic. Common first grader logic again there, folks. Buy a good protein and thats all she wrote.
"Hey V, which is the best protein??"
Again....well, see above. Chose a good slow protein to supplement with and let your diet do the real work. Dont worry about anything else.
1) take your 100% whey after workouts, prefferebly within 30 to 45 minutes after workout. Please, please , PLEASE dont split hairs and ask "what happens if I take it in one hour?" It wont really matter at our levels. Take the whey with some kind of simple carb like juice, gatorade, or fruit mix so long as you have about 50-100grams worth. Please dont take the whey with water only. Yes .... I KNOOOOOOOW a lot of you already do that and get "good" results, but the optimal way to take it is with simple carbs. Why? because the simple carbs will replace lost glycogen in the muscles and they will also help transport the whey that much quicker. Plain water just CANNOT do that. Period.
2) take your blend or non whey protein anytime during the day that you can squeeze it in. There IS no "better time" to take protein, its just another form of calories, thats all. You're simply supplementing and adding to your daily diet, pure and simple. You can mix it with milk if you want for even more calories. Either way it is ok. Trust me. And yes.... you can add whatever you want to it. Just bear in mind that those are also extra calories and you will have to see if the food groups of the calories you added will fit into your diet.
Speaking of milk......please dont ask about using milk to slow down 100% whey protein. That is truly asinine. Why would one waste the perfect post workout protein by slowing it down when there's better proteins suited for that purpose? Because you cant afford two different types of protein? Well, first of all you dont even really need a slow blend protein unless you cant get your daily requirements without it. And second of all if you use whey twice as often, you're already having to buy more protein right there, Poindexter. Slowing whey with milk just so you can use it during the day is like changing the engine in a Ferrari just so you can drive it slow enough to go to the store. Yes, you CAN do that if you want..... but what a waste of a perfectly good car just to go to the friggin store.
3) The common accepted method of protein intake is 1 gram of protein per pound of lean body mass. Its simple to figure that out. Say you weigh 200 pounds, but you are about 50 pounds overweight. Then simply deduct the fat weight and you have 150. Thats how much protein you need.
Now some people take in more. LOTS more. But most of those people are trying to add weight by "bulking" and doing some seriously intense (more intense than usual) workouts. In that scenario, 1.5 to 2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass is usually used. Does it work? I have no real proof that it does or not. But it seems to. So unless you are seriously bulking, doing some seriously intense workouts, that much protein will probably backfire on you and simply keep you from trimming down. Or worse yet, get you fatter. Remember that protein is basicaly just calories.
WEIGHT GAINERS: probably THE most misunderstood and misused supplement.
What they are: MOST weight gainers are really nothing more than concentrated calories from sugars and fillers. They are misleading because they dont tell you right away that you have to take them almost all at once. Like, a whole tub in a week or so. Hell, if you do that with a regular protein powder you will get better results because most protein powders arent loaded with empty calories.
What they do: They basicaly aid in allowing you to take in more calories by condensing them in a shake to be used as a meal replacement. Only problem is is that you can do that with anything. Even protein bars. You could dump a few protein bars in a blender full of milk and get the same effect as most weight gainers.
Now.....there ARE some weight gainers out there that are really clean and produce good results when used properly. Im using one on this very cycle. But this is not the thread for recommending things. I will show you how you canmake a good weight gainer using the protein powder you have right now. Anything but 100% whey, that is.
What they do not do: They do not build muscle any more than protein powders do. As a matter of fact, most of them will add less muscle than a good protein powder because most of the calories in weight gainers are fillers and sugars, as Ive already said. Ive debunked some of the most "famous" weight gainers here on this very board. Russian Bear 5000 for example. Ive shown how it is a rip-off when compared to a basic protein powder.
Yes....I KNOOOOOW there are many people who have gotten bigger by using weight gainers. But Ive already explained how one can do the same thing with a good protein powder if we take that protein powder all in one week too. And to make matters even better, your results will be cleaner and leaner by using the protein powder like a weight gainer. I really fail to see why most people with a basic elementary school education cannot see that.
1) Take the weight gainer shake at anytime you can squeeze more calories in. Its basicaly just a meal. Yes, you can have it at bedtime if you want. Just remember that a lot of us respond hyperly to sugars, so most of the "popular" weight gainers will probably keep you up instead of letting you sleep. And we need sleep for recovery, so thats a step backwards right there.
There IS no "better" time to take a weight gainer shake. As I said, its basicaly a meal. Use it anytime of the day you want.
Thats it on taking weight gainers. Pretty simple.
Now, there are a lot of very good weight gainer recipes in the diet forums. Basicaly you take a good protein powder and add fruits, for simple carbs and taste. Oats, for complex carbs. Peanut butter (either natural or fat free, depending on your needs and tolerances) for essential fatty acids and more carbs, plus an extra touch of protein. Yogurt (once again, any kind depending on your needs and tolerances), and even nuts if you want. Milk, for those of you that are lactose tolerant.
Use anything, but look at what you need daily to achieve your goals and use whatever ingredients will help you achieve that goal. Use what fits in your personal diet and nutrition program. For instance, dont make a weight gainer with loads of sugary fruits if you are already consuming plenty of sugar elsewhere in your diet. Same goes with everything else. Dont just make a weight gainer to be making a weight gainer, pay attention to whats going in that blender. (PLEASE.....nobody as "What if I dont have a blender?". Get creative, Poindexter. We've put this list together, but we're not going to baby walk you through this).
CREATINE:
Im going to keep this as simple as I can. Im not going to go into any fine details of each and every kind of creatine brand because there is no need. We're simply talking about the basic way to take supplements. But we will touch on the three basic kinds of creatines.
What it is:
basicaly a supplement to aid in boosting strength, endurance, and muscle size.
What is is not and what it does not do:
It is not a super strength booster or muscle builder. That is the biggest misconception about creatine. People think it will build muscle just by taking it. No. The added strength and endurance can be of help in adding a bit more weight or getting another last rep in. THAT, combined with the proper muscle building diet will add the muscle. The creatine provides the boost, plain and simple. Its not going to add much usable strength if you dont consume the right amount and types of carbs in order to give you the OOOMPH you need to use that added strength. And the less muscle building properties that your diet has, the more that those creatine gains will be water or fat. IF you gain anything at all, that is.
1) Creatine monohydrate. The most basic creatine and also the most old school. Probably obsolete in today's world if you ask me. There's much better forms of creatines out there now for the money. Monohydrate (mono for short) basicaly works by flooding the muscles with water nd nutrient. Hence the term "hydrate". It does other things, like increased strength and energy, but we're talking basic here, ok. Most people do something called "loading", which is basicaly taking bigger doses at the beggining in order to get the process started as quickly as possible. You also have to drink a ton of water. 1 gallon minimal, 1.5 to 2 gallons optimal. You can take mono during the day, before workout, during workout, or afterwards. But so many different people have had such vastly different success stories that all I can recommend is to try each one to see what suits you best. Yes....its a timely process, but your body is able to tell you what will work and what wont better than anyone else can.
Most people recommend "cycling" creatine. That is, take it for 8 weeks and stay off it for 4 weeks. Then start over. Long term studies on the overall effect of creatine on our health have not been done, so taking it this way is seen as the safest way. As I said, mono is really old school and there are better creatines out there now. Once you get off of mono, yes you will lose some of your "gains", but that is because some of those gains are water. Just how much water is really depandant on a lot of things, so each person's gains will be different.
2) Tricreatine malate.
Creatines such as SwoleV2 and V12 fall into this batch. They are also cell volumizers and they basicaly help your body use more of what you feed it by opening the blood vessels to recieve it. These are much better creatines than regular monohydrate because you dont have to load them, they wont give cramps, and they wont cause water retention. None of the bad of monohydrate, but all the good AND they are cell volumizers to boot. As my buddy fadi once wrote, tricreatine malate is basically creatine modified to be more effective than Creatine Monohydrate. Creatines like V12 contain Arginine, which is the main ingredient in cell volumizers and what gives you hard pumped muscles. And also other ingredients that would help deliver the creatine to the muscles without having to take it with sweetners.
So basically, it will give you extra strength without water retention and makes your muscles look harder and pumped up.
You do not have to load tricreatine malates like SwoleV2 or V12. You basicaly take them twice a day on workout days and once a day on non workout days. Once again, there really is no "better" time to take tricreatine, so please dont ask. Just dont take it too close to bedtime. Tricreatine gives you energy, you see, so most people preffer taking it in the morning and right before workout. Some people take it after workout to take advantage of the body's starving mode to soak up as much of it as possible. Either way is really fine, so long as it works for you.
3) Creatine Ethyl Ester.
Also known as CEE. Inn a nutshell, the very best creatine on the market today. Take it like you would take Swole or V12, but at smaller doses. Im not very well versed on taking CEE, so maybe my budies that are can chime in. What I will simply say is that it seems easier to take than mono and I would take it like I would tricreatine.
FAT BURNERS: probably my most hated supplement. I despise them and I despise the forum dedicated to them.
What they are:
chemicals that AID in small and moderate fat loss by boosting the metabolism and giving chemicaly induced energy.
What they do:
They basicaly boost your metabolism by giving you chemicaly induced energy while supressing hunger. With that chemicaly induced energy, they can help you get by on almost starvation calories. The downside is that since you wont be taking in as many calories as before, you wont be taking in enough to maintain muscle, so some of that weight loss will also be muscle. This is one reason why they seem to work so fast on the people in the ads. It just goes to figure that if the weight loss is both fat and muscle, its going to look like quick weight loss, which is misleading.
What they do not do:
They do not burn fat. The quicker you get that out of your head, the better. The magazine ads can call them fat burners legaly because they always have the ads worded in perfect disclaimer mode. Read the rest of the ad and you will notice words such as "help", "aid", "could", "would", "should". Never any definitive. They do not help very much in losing any real amount of weight. Yes, I know the ads say those people lost 60 or a hundred plus pounds, but once again, read carefuly and you will notice that most of them say something like "in addition to a good diet and exercise program". So you see, its really the diet IN CONJUNCTION with that "fat burner" that will do the trick. And chances are that if you just do the recommended diet you will still see the same results. It may take a bit longer because the diet programs they include or recommend are almost starving mode and you wont have the chemicaly induced energy. But the point of the matter is is that if you do it and tough it out without the "fat burner", you will keep probably not gain that fat back because your body and MIND will not be dependant on that false energy they give. They are great at helping you lose the last 5 or so pounds of stubborn fat, but not much more.
Take me to task on all that. I dare ya. Find interviews with top models and they will always describe their diet and eating habits. Thats where the real truth is because its an interview and no brand names are mentioned. They will all say that they use a fat burner to help with the last few pounds. Usually before a photo shoot. Never for any real and significant fat loss.
Bottom line, if they really did burn fat, all of us here would be using them and we wouldnt be needing to read about proper nutrition. We wouldnt need a Diet and Nutrition section on this board. All of us would be walking around ripped and cut. Once again, that is simple first grader logic right there.
1) take the fat burner according to the directions on the bottle. Its that simple because some of them are different. Or..
2) take them about 30 minutes before each meal.
3) take them 30 minutes before workouts to help give you energy to make the workout more intense.
Not a lot of info on how to take fat burners, is it? Thats because there really isnt a whole lot to them. They arent going to work for you very well if you have a crapy diet. They are not going to help you lose McDonald's weight. They WILL help in giving you a boost to tighten up. All the legal ones, that is. Nothing more, nothing less.
Now. On that note, lets talk about the illegal supps. Not a whole lot to say except that they also rely on good nutrition to see optimal results. Idiots can say that with roids or prohormones you dont need good genetics or a good diet. Idiots can also say the world is flat because they can see the edge. Same logic: they know enough to make dangerous and idiotic assumptions based on nothing more than circumstatial evidence coupled with ignorance. What steroids will do is give you quicker gains. The weight that would usually take you a year to put on can take half that time with steroids. But in order to do that, you have to eat like TWO horses. THAT is where the real secret to steroids and prohormones lies. They help your body use more of whatever foods you eat to give your body extra muscle building material. Yes, some can get you stronger so you lift heavier weights. But those heavy weights wont ad the size without the neccessary food to build that muscle and aid in recovery.
Thats also another secret of steroids and prohormones: they aid in recovery. That way you can work out more intensely and recover quicker. Taking steroids and prohormones actually takes more dedication in my book because of all the other things that you have to do when taking them. The extra food is only the beggining. You dont just shoot up an leave it alone. Like Ronnie Coleman once told some stupid reporter "What? You think you can just take drugs and end up looking like me?"
If you research the subject right, you will always hear this little warning "plan your cycle right or you will screw yourself up". Or something similar. But its the truth. Everything -EVERYTHING - hinges on proper nutrition for your particular goal. Supplements, even steroids and prohormones, wont do all they can for you if your body does not have the proper building blocks already in place. In some instances, they can actually backfire if you dont have a solid, nutrition program made specificaly for your goals already in place.
Ok, in this thread, we are going to be discussing how to take the basic supplements. The wheres, the whens, and they whys. Hopefully this will curb down the many simple questions that some newbs have and therefore make this board a bit more productive by keeping to more in depth topics. Not that there's anything wrong with newbs asking questions, but its always better to answer all in one fell soop.
We're going to be discussing this in simple terms. No essays, no studies, no nothing except the most common and result proven methods of taking supplements. We're not going to be splitting hairs by talking about the fine details either. This post is going to be long enough as it is.
NOTE: Please, please PLEASE dont anyone ruin this thread with "I disagree with XYZ because I took it this way and that way and I got results". Cool. Ok. Great for you. We cannot possibly hope to cover every possible scenario, thats why Im sticking only to the most common ones. If you got results another way, great for you. There's always an exception to everything. I mean..... murderers are supposed to go to jail, right? But we all know OJ's walking around free. Always an exception.
Now the first question is "V, how are YOU qualified to talk to US about supplements and how to take them?" Simple: Ive taken them and Ive researched the living hell out of them. Thats how I was able to go from 147 to 174 in 11 months in 2004 while keeping bodyfat in check. Ive also got many, many years experience being a supplement whore back in the day when I believed that I had to take them to see good gains. And guess what? When I was no longer able to afford them, I really didnt see any difference in the gains I was making. It wasnt until february of 2004 that I came here and met a member called musclesntx who taught me about proper dieting and eating for a goal. Once I saw what PROPER nutrition could do, my supplement intake dropped and what supplements I DID take had even better effect. Thats the honest to gods truth.
Not only that, but in doing my research, I saw person after person take everything under the sun, without a proper nutrition program supporting those supps, and have little to no results to show for it in the end. You know the people Im talking about....the loudmouths who constantly correct everyone and talk about all they take, yet dont post pictures because they cant back their talk up. So in a nutshell, you could say Im an average person who has just happened to be lucky enough to see the truth about supplements first hand. Thats all.
Before we go further, let me state for the record, that if supplements really did what the magazine ads lead one to believe, and really, really worked to make us look like those muscled up models, the pros would not need steroids. That is ....that is as simple as I can possibly make that. If you cannot or will not accept that simple first grader logic, then please do us all a favor and stop coming here. Plain and simple. You will only be wasting your time looking for a wonder pill or magic powder and your incesant questions will get old. Period.
On that note, let me tell you what supplements are. You know how a good spotter helps you get out those last two or three reps? Thats what supplements are. That is the perfect analogy for a supplement. We all know that in order to have those last two or three forced reps do us any good, the muscle needs to be driven to a certain point or those forced reps are not going to do much. In other words, you have to have the correct base established first before those last reps can truly be effective. And in this case, the muscle needs to be driven to a certain point where they will be effective.
So imagine going to the gym and only doing two reps with a weight that you can easily do 8-10 reps with. Its not going to work, is it? But those two or three reps will do us plenty good OVER A CERTAIN PERIOD OF TIME if the muscle has been thuroughly worked and the proper base for those last reps has been established first. And thats what supplements do: they work over a certain period of time ONLY IF THE PROPER AND CORRECT BASE HAS BEEN ESTABLISHED FIRST. And that base is a solid, goal oriented nutrition program.
"Eating clean" is not enough. Ive said it before and I will continue to say it; in order for any supplement to be as effective as it can possible be, it needs to have the right nutrition program supporting it. You have to eat for whatever goal you want or those supplements arent going to be as effective as they can possibly be. Why? because all supplements do is SUPPLEMENT! HELLOOO! Supplements by themselves dont do anything. Just like those two or three reps dont do anything unless the muscle has first been driven to a certain point where they will be effective.
Ok, now that that is out of the way, we will be dicussing each supplement in a "what it is", "what it does", and "what it does not do" format. Then and only then will we talk about how to take it because then it will make more sense and you can possibly see why your best friend's brother's sister takes her supplements by snorting them like coke instead of drinking them in a shake.
The supplements we will talk about are 1) protein 2) creatine 3) fat burners. And to a small degree, steroids. Those seem to be the staples of the supplement industry and most other supplements simply are a variation thereof.
PROTEIN POWDERS: Probably the most asked about supplement.
What it is:
Protein powder is basicaly calories from protein in a very condensed form. Nothing more, nothing less.
What it does:
It helps the body build muscle by helping us take in more calories from protein and aiding in recovery. Plain and simple.
What it does not do:
It does not "build" muscle. No protein powder out there will ever "build muscle" by itself. Protein powders can only supplement whatever nutrition program you have by adding more calories from protein. Plain and simple.
Redundant, you say? Sure. But trust me, we cant seem to hammer that point enough for some reason. Consuming protein shakes is not going to do you much good if your body is not already recieving proper nutrition from natural foods. The protein powder has nothing to build on, you see. Protein powder is NOT a natural food and should not replace real food any more than absolutely neccessary. Say for instance you require 200grams of protein a day. Your daily diet, however, only gives you 175 grams of protein. Then you simply use the powder to add the extra 25 grams. Simple.
You do NOT just take protein to be taking it. Its just calories in that sense. In spanish we have a saying that goes "a lo pendejo". Pendejo is basicaly "dumbass". So that spanish saying could easily be "ala dumbass", or without any thought. Taking protein without any regard to a solid, goal oriented diet is , well.....you get the picture.
There are basicaly two kinds of protein: 100% whey, and not 100% whey, often reffered to as "blends". Those blends could be eggwhite protein, casein, micellar, or milk isolate. Whats the difference? Well 100% whey is the quickest burning protein. Thats it. It is because of that that 100% whey is optimal for after workout when the body is craving sustenance to begin the recovery period. It makes little sense to take a slow burning protein at that point in time. I didnt say you COULDNT, just said it doesnt make much sense.
The other proteinss are slow burning, some more than others. The slower the protein, the better it is suited for non workout use because the body will absorb it slower and have a steady source of nutrient throughout the day. Not like the "quick hit" of 100% whey. During the day we dont need a quick hit, we need constant nutrient, and blends provide that.
They are also optimal for that much beloved night time shake. Your body is basicaly fasting during those 8 hours of sleep, so having a slow burning protein in your system helps keep catabolism in check and prevents you from having to take a whey shake in the morning to counter it. Im sorry, but using whey in the morning like that is really not very smart. Oh, you can definately do that if you want, but its the same as changing the radiator fluid in your car AFTER it has frozen. Better to change it beforehand than to try and repair the damage afterwards. Thats also basic first grader logic.
"Hey V, which is the slowest burning protein??"
Sorry, bros. Im not touching that one. At our levels, we are not going to notice the difference between one protein that aborbs in 8 hours vs. one that absorbs in 6. Unless you are cut and ripped like a pro bodybuilder, where you can see the fine details and the littlest things can make a major difference, you're not going to notice anything drastic. Common first grader logic again there, folks. Buy a good protein and thats all she wrote.
"Hey V, which is the best protein??"
Again....well, see above. Chose a good slow protein to supplement with and let your diet do the real work. Dont worry about anything else.
1) take your 100% whey after workouts, prefferebly within 30 to 45 minutes after workout. Please, please , PLEASE dont split hairs and ask "what happens if I take it in one hour?" It wont really matter at our levels. Take the whey with some kind of simple carb like juice, gatorade, or fruit mix so long as you have about 50-100grams worth. Please dont take the whey with water only. Yes .... I KNOOOOOOOW a lot of you already do that and get "good" results, but the optimal way to take it is with simple carbs. Why? because the simple carbs will replace lost glycogen in the muscles and they will also help transport the whey that much quicker. Plain water just CANNOT do that. Period.
2) take your blend or non whey protein anytime during the day that you can squeeze it in. There IS no "better time" to take protein, its just another form of calories, thats all. You're simply supplementing and adding to your daily diet, pure and simple. You can mix it with milk if you want for even more calories. Either way it is ok. Trust me. And yes.... you can add whatever you want to it. Just bear in mind that those are also extra calories and you will have to see if the food groups of the calories you added will fit into your diet.
Speaking of milk......please dont ask about using milk to slow down 100% whey protein. That is truly asinine. Why would one waste the perfect post workout protein by slowing it down when there's better proteins suited for that purpose? Because you cant afford two different types of protein? Well, first of all you dont even really need a slow blend protein unless you cant get your daily requirements without it. And second of all if you use whey twice as often, you're already having to buy more protein right there, Poindexter. Slowing whey with milk just so you can use it during the day is like changing the engine in a Ferrari just so you can drive it slow enough to go to the store. Yes, you CAN do that if you want..... but what a waste of a perfectly good car just to go to the friggin store.
3) The common accepted method of protein intake is 1 gram of protein per pound of lean body mass. Its simple to figure that out. Say you weigh 200 pounds, but you are about 50 pounds overweight. Then simply deduct the fat weight and you have 150. Thats how much protein you need.
Now some people take in more. LOTS more. But most of those people are trying to add weight by "bulking" and doing some seriously intense (more intense than usual) workouts. In that scenario, 1.5 to 2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass is usually used. Does it work? I have no real proof that it does or not. But it seems to. So unless you are seriously bulking, doing some seriously intense workouts, that much protein will probably backfire on you and simply keep you from trimming down. Or worse yet, get you fatter. Remember that protein is basicaly just calories.
WEIGHT GAINERS: probably THE most misunderstood and misused supplement.
What they are: MOST weight gainers are really nothing more than concentrated calories from sugars and fillers. They are misleading because they dont tell you right away that you have to take them almost all at once. Like, a whole tub in a week or so. Hell, if you do that with a regular protein powder you will get better results because most protein powders arent loaded with empty calories.
What they do: They basicaly aid in allowing you to take in more calories by condensing them in a shake to be used as a meal replacement. Only problem is is that you can do that with anything. Even protein bars. You could dump a few protein bars in a blender full of milk and get the same effect as most weight gainers.
Now.....there ARE some weight gainers out there that are really clean and produce good results when used properly. Im using one on this very cycle. But this is not the thread for recommending things. I will show you how you canmake a good weight gainer using the protein powder you have right now. Anything but 100% whey, that is.
What they do not do: They do not build muscle any more than protein powders do. As a matter of fact, most of them will add less muscle than a good protein powder because most of the calories in weight gainers are fillers and sugars, as Ive already said. Ive debunked some of the most "famous" weight gainers here on this very board. Russian Bear 5000 for example. Ive shown how it is a rip-off when compared to a basic protein powder.
Yes....I KNOOOOOW there are many people who have gotten bigger by using weight gainers. But Ive already explained how one can do the same thing with a good protein powder if we take that protein powder all in one week too. And to make matters even better, your results will be cleaner and leaner by using the protein powder like a weight gainer. I really fail to see why most people with a basic elementary school education cannot see that.
1) Take the weight gainer shake at anytime you can squeeze more calories in. Its basicaly just a meal. Yes, you can have it at bedtime if you want. Just remember that a lot of us respond hyperly to sugars, so most of the "popular" weight gainers will probably keep you up instead of letting you sleep. And we need sleep for recovery, so thats a step backwards right there.
There IS no "better" time to take a weight gainer shake. As I said, its basicaly a meal. Use it anytime of the day you want.
Thats it on taking weight gainers. Pretty simple.
Now, there are a lot of very good weight gainer recipes in the diet forums. Basicaly you take a good protein powder and add fruits, for simple carbs and taste. Oats, for complex carbs. Peanut butter (either natural or fat free, depending on your needs and tolerances) for essential fatty acids and more carbs, plus an extra touch of protein. Yogurt (once again, any kind depending on your needs and tolerances), and even nuts if you want. Milk, for those of you that are lactose tolerant.
Use anything, but look at what you need daily to achieve your goals and use whatever ingredients will help you achieve that goal. Use what fits in your personal diet and nutrition program. For instance, dont make a weight gainer with loads of sugary fruits if you are already consuming plenty of sugar elsewhere in your diet. Same goes with everything else. Dont just make a weight gainer to be making a weight gainer, pay attention to whats going in that blender. (PLEASE.....nobody as "What if I dont have a blender?". Get creative, Poindexter. We've put this list together, but we're not going to baby walk you through this).
CREATINE:
Im going to keep this as simple as I can. Im not going to go into any fine details of each and every kind of creatine brand because there is no need. We're simply talking about the basic way to take supplements. But we will touch on the three basic kinds of creatines.
What it is:
basicaly a supplement to aid in boosting strength, endurance, and muscle size.
What is is not and what it does not do:
It is not a super strength booster or muscle builder. That is the biggest misconception about creatine. People think it will build muscle just by taking it. No. The added strength and endurance can be of help in adding a bit more weight or getting another last rep in. THAT, combined with the proper muscle building diet will add the muscle. The creatine provides the boost, plain and simple. Its not going to add much usable strength if you dont consume the right amount and types of carbs in order to give you the OOOMPH you need to use that added strength. And the less muscle building properties that your diet has, the more that those creatine gains will be water or fat. IF you gain anything at all, that is.
1) Creatine monohydrate. The most basic creatine and also the most old school. Probably obsolete in today's world if you ask me. There's much better forms of creatines out there now for the money. Monohydrate (mono for short) basicaly works by flooding the muscles with water nd nutrient. Hence the term "hydrate". It does other things, like increased strength and energy, but we're talking basic here, ok. Most people do something called "loading", which is basicaly taking bigger doses at the beggining in order to get the process started as quickly as possible. You also have to drink a ton of water. 1 gallon minimal, 1.5 to 2 gallons optimal. You can take mono during the day, before workout, during workout, or afterwards. But so many different people have had such vastly different success stories that all I can recommend is to try each one to see what suits you best. Yes....its a timely process, but your body is able to tell you what will work and what wont better than anyone else can.
Most people recommend "cycling" creatine. That is, take it for 8 weeks and stay off it for 4 weeks. Then start over. Long term studies on the overall effect of creatine on our health have not been done, so taking it this way is seen as the safest way. As I said, mono is really old school and there are better creatines out there now. Once you get off of mono, yes you will lose some of your "gains", but that is because some of those gains are water. Just how much water is really depandant on a lot of things, so each person's gains will be different.
2) Tricreatine malate.
Creatines such as SwoleV2 and V12 fall into this batch. They are also cell volumizers and they basicaly help your body use more of what you feed it by opening the blood vessels to recieve it. These are much better creatines than regular monohydrate because you dont have to load them, they wont give cramps, and they wont cause water retention. None of the bad of monohydrate, but all the good AND they are cell volumizers to boot. As my buddy fadi once wrote, tricreatine malate is basically creatine modified to be more effective than Creatine Monohydrate. Creatines like V12 contain Arginine, which is the main ingredient in cell volumizers and what gives you hard pumped muscles. And also other ingredients that would help deliver the creatine to the muscles without having to take it with sweetners.
So basically, it will give you extra strength without water retention and makes your muscles look harder and pumped up.
You do not have to load tricreatine malates like SwoleV2 or V12. You basicaly take them twice a day on workout days and once a day on non workout days. Once again, there really is no "better" time to take tricreatine, so please dont ask. Just dont take it too close to bedtime. Tricreatine gives you energy, you see, so most people preffer taking it in the morning and right before workout. Some people take it after workout to take advantage of the body's starving mode to soak up as much of it as possible. Either way is really fine, so long as it works for you.
3) Creatine Ethyl Ester.
Also known as CEE. Inn a nutshell, the very best creatine on the market today. Take it like you would take Swole or V12, but at smaller doses. Im not very well versed on taking CEE, so maybe my budies that are can chime in. What I will simply say is that it seems easier to take than mono and I would take it like I would tricreatine.
FAT BURNERS: probably my most hated supplement. I despise them and I despise the forum dedicated to them.
What they are:
chemicals that AID in small and moderate fat loss by boosting the metabolism and giving chemicaly induced energy.
What they do:
They basicaly boost your metabolism by giving you chemicaly induced energy while supressing hunger. With that chemicaly induced energy, they can help you get by on almost starvation calories. The downside is that since you wont be taking in as many calories as before, you wont be taking in enough to maintain muscle, so some of that weight loss will also be muscle. This is one reason why they seem to work so fast on the people in the ads. It just goes to figure that if the weight loss is both fat and muscle, its going to look like quick weight loss, which is misleading.
What they do not do:
They do not burn fat. The quicker you get that out of your head, the better. The magazine ads can call them fat burners legaly because they always have the ads worded in perfect disclaimer mode. Read the rest of the ad and you will notice words such as "help", "aid", "could", "would", "should". Never any definitive. They do not help very much in losing any real amount of weight. Yes, I know the ads say those people lost 60 or a hundred plus pounds, but once again, read carefuly and you will notice that most of them say something like "in addition to a good diet and exercise program". So you see, its really the diet IN CONJUNCTION with that "fat burner" that will do the trick. And chances are that if you just do the recommended diet you will still see the same results. It may take a bit longer because the diet programs they include or recommend are almost starving mode and you wont have the chemicaly induced energy. But the point of the matter is is that if you do it and tough it out without the "fat burner", you will keep probably not gain that fat back because your body and MIND will not be dependant on that false energy they give. They are great at helping you lose the last 5 or so pounds of stubborn fat, but not much more.
Take me to task on all that. I dare ya. Find interviews with top models and they will always describe their diet and eating habits. Thats where the real truth is because its an interview and no brand names are mentioned. They will all say that they use a fat burner to help with the last few pounds. Usually before a photo shoot. Never for any real and significant fat loss.
Bottom line, if they really did burn fat, all of us here would be using them and we wouldnt be needing to read about proper nutrition. We wouldnt need a Diet and Nutrition section on this board. All of us would be walking around ripped and cut. Once again, that is simple first grader logic right there.
1) take the fat burner according to the directions on the bottle. Its that simple because some of them are different. Or..
2) take them about 30 minutes before each meal.
3) take them 30 minutes before workouts to help give you energy to make the workout more intense.
Not a lot of info on how to take fat burners, is it? Thats because there really isnt a whole lot to them. They arent going to work for you very well if you have a crapy diet. They are not going to help you lose McDonald's weight. They WILL help in giving you a boost to tighten up. All the legal ones, that is. Nothing more, nothing less.
Now. On that note, lets talk about the illegal supps. Not a whole lot to say except that they also rely on good nutrition to see optimal results. Idiots can say that with roids or prohormones you dont need good genetics or a good diet. Idiots can also say the world is flat because they can see the edge. Same logic: they know enough to make dangerous and idiotic assumptions based on nothing more than circumstatial evidence coupled with ignorance. What steroids will do is give you quicker gains. The weight that would usually take you a year to put on can take half that time with steroids. But in order to do that, you have to eat like TWO horses. THAT is where the real secret to steroids and prohormones lies. They help your body use more of whatever foods you eat to give your body extra muscle building material. Yes, some can get you stronger so you lift heavier weights. But those heavy weights wont ad the size without the neccessary food to build that muscle and aid in recovery.
Thats also another secret of steroids and prohormones: they aid in recovery. That way you can work out more intensely and recover quicker. Taking steroids and prohormones actually takes more dedication in my book because of all the other things that you have to do when taking them. The extra food is only the beggining. You dont just shoot up an leave it alone. Like Ronnie Coleman once told some stupid reporter "What? You think you can just take drugs and end up looking like me?"
If you research the subject right, you will always hear this little warning "plan your cycle right or you will screw yourself up". Or something similar. But its the truth. Everything -EVERYTHING - hinges on proper nutrition for your particular goal. Supplements, even steroids and prohormones, wont do all they can for you if your body does not have the proper building blocks already in place. In some instances, they can actually backfire if you dont have a solid, nutrition program made specificaly for your goals already in place.